by Neil Richard
The basic idea behind this interview series is to interview local leaders that live, work, or have an important impact on King George County. We have asked various citizens for recommendations on who they see as a local leader. Additionally, we feel that everyone has a story and it deserves to be told. So we want to know their story. As you can see with the questions below, we want to share their story with the rest of the citizens in King George County. If you have somebody you would like to nominate for a future interview, please contact us.
Elizabeth Lee, Curator, King George County Historical Society
Introduction
The basic idea behind this interview series is to interview local leaders that live, work, or have an important impact on King George County. We have asked various citizens for recommendations on who they see as a local leader. Additionally, we feel that everyone has a story and it deserves to be told. So we want to know their story. As you can see with the questions below, we want to share their story with the rest of the citizens in King George County. If you have somebody you would like to nominate for a future interview, please contact us.
Elizabeth Lee, Curator, King George County Historical Society
Basic Biographical Information
I graduated from King George in 1964, what they call the old King George Elementary School. I left high school and went to William and Mary for a year. I always tell people I fell in love. Actually I was leaving King George and I was already in love so I came home and got married. But I still wanted to finish college so I got on the programs that were being offered in Dahlgren. I went back to Mary Washington. They offered all of these math classes. The admissions director looked at me and said "we don't have enough credits here for you to be able to major in math so how about physics." So I graduated with a degree in physics and went back to work in Dahlgren. I retired in 1994.
In the meantime, we had four children. Three boys and a girl. The two oldest boys were in school by the time I went back to school. My oldest told everybody that he was "going to go to school and so was momma."
Special certifications? I don't know. I can't think of any.
So I finished Mary Washington in 1973. I took some graduate classes but like I said, I left Dahlgren in 1994 and I started pursuing my real love, history.
I will add to all of that. The thing that I try to tell the kids and adults that come here to the museum is to look around as you're walking in the footsteps of our founding fathers in King George. You may not hear that very much. We know that James Madison was born here but he really didn't live here. No one realizes that George Washington lived in King George at Ferry Farm. When he was a boy living in Ferry Farm, that part of Stafford was in King George County. And his father's will is in the Courthouse here. He also had family in the Mathias Point area. So I try to emphasize that there is history here. Although at one time, somebody once said that "this County has no history." Of course that blew my mind. But we try to emphasize something. Kids at one point didn't even know that James Madison was born here.
About the time I left work, I became a member of the Virginia Genealogical Society and I was almost immediately put on the Board. I've been on the Advisory Board for the Board of Supervisors for the Ralph Bunche School. Northern Neck of Virginia Historical Society. Friends of the State Archives, which is the archival portion of the state library, I was President of that one. I don't know when I wasn't on a board until recently when I've slowed down a little bit.
I was the immediate past President of the King George County Historical Society. I've actually served as the President twice. I've been what they call the Curator but I'd rather say the Director of the Museum and I have been since Day One. I told the President then, if you want to remove me, because it's an appointed job, if you ever want to remove me, just remember I'll be coming in here every day anyway so you might as well keep me here.
I was the immediate past President of the King George County Historical Society. I've actually served as the President twice. I've been what they call the Curator but I'd rather say the Director of the Museum and I have been since Day One. I told the President then, if you want to remove me, because it's an appointed job, if you ever want to remove me, just remember I'll be coming in here every day anyway so you might as well keep me here.
Personal Questions
What do you remember about your grandparents?
I told somebody the other day that my roots are so deep in King George, I'm made up of dirt. My mother's family, I never knew either one of her parents. My grandfather died when she was two years old. He worked for Goldsmith's in Fredericksburg. He actually modeled clothes for them. He was a handsome man. He was tall and slender. He had olive skin. My grandmother died about two years before I was born from cancer. So my mother was left to her own defenses then.
My father's side, he was from Buckingham County. I knew both grandparents, they were both born and raised in Buckingham. So I got to meet a little more of the family, the younger part of the family, that way. I was born in Charlotte, North Carolina. Everybody I say that to, I say it was an accident. My father was a bus driver. When I was nine months old we came back here to Richmond but my maternal grandmother's parents were still living up here across from the Historyland Cemetery. Where those apartments are, our house used to be there. We lived there for awhile.
They would come to Richmond and pick me up and I would come up here and spend some time and either they would take me back or my parents would come up and get me. So I remember a lot more of here than I do Richmond. All kinds of memories. People say how could you because I wasn't even four years old when she died. They were really close to me. She had one sister and two brothers that were all still living so I remember all of them. The sister especially thought that the sun rose and set in my behind. She left me everything she had in her will which turned out to be nothing. She became blind and had to be taken care of by social services so they got everything except her bed. One of my uncles gave his farm to my mother and that was where I was raised until I left home and got married.
My grandfather had three sisters still alive after I was born and I remember one aunt who was one of the oldest. She was always in bed and if my mother left us there with her daughter, we would sit on the side bed and I always remember the clock ticking because it was so quiet. We wouldn't say a word. The two youngest sisters, I used to have fun with them because they were fun.
But that's sort of the reason for my love of history because I knew them. Knowing them, I knew they lived a different life than we did. One of the funny things was that we'd go over to the farm and my aunt and two uncles were living there and there was this pile of corn cobs sitting at the door. And I would sit on the floor and build pig pens with these corn cobs. I had no idea until I was grown and it hit me. I know what those corn cobs are for now!
Aunts, uncles, cousins. When I talk about my cousin, she's probably my third cousin once removed, I was around her all my life. They're closer than first cousins.
How did your grandparents instill that love of history?
I wish I could remember any stories that they told me. If I could go back with an adult mind and remember. I guess it was curiosity and knowing them. I thought I knew them but where were they born. My mother even talked about my great grandfather's parents and I knew they were related and it turned out they were first cousins. Their mothers were sisters. And the name was Fitzhugh. The Fitzhughs were a very early name in Virginia. We think William Fitzhugh came here about 1672 and he had probably been here before. He worked for Lord Fairfax and he ended up with something like 50,000 acres of land, including Alexandria.
So I guess what really got me going was how am I related to that man? My grandmother was Elizabeth Fitzhugh. And I worked that all the way back and finally I know how I am related. I actually got enough proof that I was able to get into the Daughters of the American Revolution (DAR). Which I didn't think I'd do because my fourth great-grandfather never married. But he wrote a will and he named all of his children and he named his housekeeper as their mother. And he gave her a legacy. And the DAR accepted it. I don't do much with the DAR but I'm really thrilled that I was able to make it in.
What historical events influenced your life the most?
9/11 changed the way we interacted with our children more.
I lived in Colonial Beach during Hurricane Hazel and the eye went through the beach. That was 1955 I think. It dumped all the slot machines into the river and by the eye of the storm the divers were out diving for slot machines. We witnessed it because my father put us in the car and took us down during the eye. I know you're not supposed to but he took us down there and we stopped and walked along the crumpled up boardwalk. And there were the divers out there.
You said death in a family. Two and a half years ago we lost our daughter. I had gone to El Salvador to get her, we had adopted her. There was a star or planet that was extra bright and I was down there and saw the same one and thought wow, what a small world we live in. Her death changed our lives completely. We went to get her and our lives had been flipped upside down since she died. She has two grandchildren, they kind of hold us together the two of us, my husband and I. One lives next door and the other one is at Edwards Air Force Base. But this old granny knows how to FaceTime and so does he and he's only eight months old.
She left a legacy. You know, I had often thought about what would happen if we had lost one of our children that I couldn't handle it. Then for it to happen to us, nothing, nothing could compare. No thoughts could compare.
This museum has been great. I've devoted a lot of time to it. Jean Graham and I have written a book. It's about Booth's escape. It's about the 34 hours of his time in King George County and what do we know about it. There was a guy that walked the whole route and took pictures back in 1901. So I compared them with family records and photos and came up with a story. And now the board that's working on the 300th anniversary wants us to write another book like the pictorial history book.
Outside of work and home, what is your favorite place in King George?
I'm the only one of my siblings that's stayed in King George. The three boys, one moved to Virginia Beach, one moved to Florida, and one moved to Texas, then Connecticut, then Fredericksburg but he's deceased now. I'm the only one that stayed here. I keep saying I'm just a country girl at heart. I don't want to live in the city or even the suburbs.
Is there one particular place? We have a lot of woods around us. I used to like to go walking back in the woods. I haven't been able to do that more recently. This summer, because of the heat. But we have a farm next to us and then two houses, two pieces of property there. With the farms, it's all open field. Just walking around there. I love going to the park. I like Barnesfield but there's no particular place. I've done a lot of running around in the County, just looking at old places for my book. Looking for where a certain stream comes out. I know that sounds crazy. But just the County or the country-side. I guess that's why I'm not a big development fan.
I used to like to go down to the farm where I was raised. In 1999 an arsonist burned it to the ground just to have fun. Just this past year, something caught the barn on fire and now it's gone. So there's nothing there. The old house that's up on the hill across Route 301 from it was my Aunt Willie's place. So we visited there quite a lot. But that wasn't one of my favorite places. I can't leave the church out because that's probably the place I go to the most now other than home and the museum.
What person, place, or thing do you think is the most underappreciated in King George County?
I think to most newcomers here, they don't seem to appreciate the old homes and the history behind them. They'd just as soon bulldoze them down and build a new house. An example was Willow Hill. It was the home of the Arnold family. Their cemetery back behind their place in Presidential Lakes. They bulldozed that one down to build Presidential Lakes. The Arnold house was right across from the high school pretty much. At least they didn't tear down the cemetery. The old clubhouse in Presidential Lakes where the pool is now used to be Cleveland. The second Cleveland. The original one burned done.
I can't say any one particular place, but I sure would like to have a picture of the Bedford house. Any place I can find an old building.
I told somebody the other day that my roots are so deep in King George, I'm made up of dirt. My mother's family, I never knew either one of her parents. My grandfather died when she was two years old. He worked for Goldsmith's in Fredericksburg. He actually modeled clothes for them. He was a handsome man. He was tall and slender. He had olive skin. My grandmother died about two years before I was born from cancer. So my mother was left to her own defenses then.
My father's side, he was from Buckingham County. I knew both grandparents, they were both born and raised in Buckingham. So I got to meet a little more of the family, the younger part of the family, that way. I was born in Charlotte, North Carolina. Everybody I say that to, I say it was an accident. My father was a bus driver. When I was nine months old we came back here to Richmond but my maternal grandmother's parents were still living up here across from the Historyland Cemetery. Where those apartments are, our house used to be there. We lived there for awhile.
They would come to Richmond and pick me up and I would come up here and spend some time and either they would take me back or my parents would come up and get me. So I remember a lot more of here than I do Richmond. All kinds of memories. People say how could you because I wasn't even four years old when she died. They were really close to me. She had one sister and two brothers that were all still living so I remember all of them. The sister especially thought that the sun rose and set in my behind. She left me everything she had in her will which turned out to be nothing. She became blind and had to be taken care of by social services so they got everything except her bed. One of my uncles gave his farm to my mother and that was where I was raised until I left home and got married.
My grandfather had three sisters still alive after I was born and I remember one aunt who was one of the oldest. She was always in bed and if my mother left us there with her daughter, we would sit on the side bed and I always remember the clock ticking because it was so quiet. We wouldn't say a word. The two youngest sisters, I used to have fun with them because they were fun.
But that's sort of the reason for my love of history because I knew them. Knowing them, I knew they lived a different life than we did. One of the funny things was that we'd go over to the farm and my aunt and two uncles were living there and there was this pile of corn cobs sitting at the door. And I would sit on the floor and build pig pens with these corn cobs. I had no idea until I was grown and it hit me. I know what those corn cobs are for now!
Aunts, uncles, cousins. When I talk about my cousin, she's probably my third cousin once removed, I was around her all my life. They're closer than first cousins.
How did your grandparents instill that love of history?
I wish I could remember any stories that they told me. If I could go back with an adult mind and remember. I guess it was curiosity and knowing them. I thought I knew them but where were they born. My mother even talked about my great grandfather's parents and I knew they were related and it turned out they were first cousins. Their mothers were sisters. And the name was Fitzhugh. The Fitzhughs were a very early name in Virginia. We think William Fitzhugh came here about 1672 and he had probably been here before. He worked for Lord Fairfax and he ended up with something like 50,000 acres of land, including Alexandria.
So I guess what really got me going was how am I related to that man? My grandmother was Elizabeth Fitzhugh. And I worked that all the way back and finally I know how I am related. I actually got enough proof that I was able to get into the Daughters of the American Revolution (DAR). Which I didn't think I'd do because my fourth great-grandfather never married. But he wrote a will and he named all of his children and he named his housekeeper as their mother. And he gave her a legacy. And the DAR accepted it. I don't do much with the DAR but I'm really thrilled that I was able to make it in.
What historical events influenced your life the most?
9/11 changed the way we interacted with our children more.
I lived in Colonial Beach during Hurricane Hazel and the eye went through the beach. That was 1955 I think. It dumped all the slot machines into the river and by the eye of the storm the divers were out diving for slot machines. We witnessed it because my father put us in the car and took us down during the eye. I know you're not supposed to but he took us down there and we stopped and walked along the crumpled up boardwalk. And there were the divers out there.
You said death in a family. Two and a half years ago we lost our daughter. I had gone to El Salvador to get her, we had adopted her. There was a star or planet that was extra bright and I was down there and saw the same one and thought wow, what a small world we live in. Her death changed our lives completely. We went to get her and our lives had been flipped upside down since she died. She has two grandchildren, they kind of hold us together the two of us, my husband and I. One lives next door and the other one is at Edwards Air Force Base. But this old granny knows how to FaceTime and so does he and he's only eight months old.
She left a legacy. You know, I had often thought about what would happen if we had lost one of our children that I couldn't handle it. Then for it to happen to us, nothing, nothing could compare. No thoughts could compare.
This museum has been great. I've devoted a lot of time to it. Jean Graham and I have written a book. It's about Booth's escape. It's about the 34 hours of his time in King George County and what do we know about it. There was a guy that walked the whole route and took pictures back in 1901. So I compared them with family records and photos and came up with a story. And now the board that's working on the 300th anniversary wants us to write another book like the pictorial history book.
Outside of work and home, what is your favorite place in King George?
I'm the only one of my siblings that's stayed in King George. The three boys, one moved to Virginia Beach, one moved to Florida, and one moved to Texas, then Connecticut, then Fredericksburg but he's deceased now. I'm the only one that stayed here. I keep saying I'm just a country girl at heart. I don't want to live in the city or even the suburbs.
Is there one particular place? We have a lot of woods around us. I used to like to go walking back in the woods. I haven't been able to do that more recently. This summer, because of the heat. But we have a farm next to us and then two houses, two pieces of property there. With the farms, it's all open field. Just walking around there. I love going to the park. I like Barnesfield but there's no particular place. I've done a lot of running around in the County, just looking at old places for my book. Looking for where a certain stream comes out. I know that sounds crazy. But just the County or the country-side. I guess that's why I'm not a big development fan.
I used to like to go down to the farm where I was raised. In 1999 an arsonist burned it to the ground just to have fun. Just this past year, something caught the barn on fire and now it's gone. So there's nothing there. The old house that's up on the hill across Route 301 from it was my Aunt Willie's place. So we visited there quite a lot. But that wasn't one of my favorite places. I can't leave the church out because that's probably the place I go to the most now other than home and the museum.
What person, place, or thing do you think is the most underappreciated in King George County?
I think to most newcomers here, they don't seem to appreciate the old homes and the history behind them. They'd just as soon bulldoze them down and build a new house. An example was Willow Hill. It was the home of the Arnold family. Their cemetery back behind their place in Presidential Lakes. They bulldozed that one down to build Presidential Lakes. The Arnold house was right across from the high school pretty much. At least they didn't tear down the cemetery. The old clubhouse in Presidential Lakes where the pool is now used to be Cleveland. The second Cleveland. The original one burned done.
I can't say any one particular place, but I sure would like to have a picture of the Bedford house. Any place I can find an old building.
Professional Questions
Who is your inspiration or mentor?
I have to say two. Bill Deyo. He's the historian for the Potomac [Patawomeck] Tribe. He could tell you anything you wanted to know about Stafford County people. Even who didn't have the right father or right child, he knew them all. He says his Aunt Polly told him everything. He did a lot of genealogy for Stafford. Of course some of that blew over into King George so he was quite an inspiration.
The other one was our friend Aubrey Jennings. When he retired from Dahlgren, several years before I did, he went to work and most of what is in our file cabinets came from him.
What is your ideal vision for King George County in the future?
Very controlled development. I really wouldn't want to see any more but that's not going to happen. But I would like to see a lot of consideration for our history. A lot of times people will just go bulldozing through something and have no idea about the history. No idea what should and shouldn't be preserved. But I'd like to see that supported by our government. I know they have a lot of other things that have to be done but that shouldn't cost any money, I wouldn't think.
I just have this fear that by the time I get old, I won't recognize the place. I often say that my mother, if she came back today, she would not know where she was.
What do you feel are the top 3 issues to address in King George?
I have to look right here. I try not to get involved with a lot of politics but you can't help it sometimes. The issue here is the County does not really address its history. We have a 300th anniversary coming up and they have formed a committee. Which is a lot better than what happened in 2007 when the whole state of Virginia celebrated the 400th anniversary of Jamestown. We took the lead on that, as in the Historical Society, and we started with the Administrator and it went down to the Assistant and then he sent us to Parks and Rec. So the County never really got into it at all. So that's basically why we wrote the book to that we at least had something to show for it even if the County didn't participate.
Now there's the issue about the Courthouse. I don't want to see anything happen to this building but that may not happen. They, as in our government officials, have convinced me to move our research area into the Virginiana Room in the Smoot Library. I finally agreed after many, many questions. Our books are still our books. Our files are still our files. We'll keep this area, the museum, just for our museum pieces.
The last is we have museum pieces in this County in private homes. We've never been able to show them. They're beautiful pieces. It's lack of space. We found these cases here that go up higher to get more stuff in these than the shorter ones and that's fine for the smaller pieces but it's not good for the bigger stuff. We have a loom. We have a beautiful quilt that was done by slaves in 1835. The family gave it to us because they didn't know what to do with it. It's probably larger than a King Size bed. Some of the spots, some of the areas on it, the material is still bright enough to see the design. You can see the stitching. Very few places where it was torn. But we have to keep it on the shelf in there covered in archival tissue paper. And there it sits. We have the old voting drum. It was a drum about this high that you turn and you'd stick your vote in the slot in the top like a big piggy bank and it rolled and went down. The votes had to be hand counted. We've got a beautiful settee that was sold at auction in 1842 from Spy Hill. What are we going to do with them? I was told we would keep this museum but the other day I was told no, everybody was getting out. We have no prospects. I think the problem is the people that worked on that have no clue what we've got.
What do you feel are the top 3 successes in King George?
I had one earlier and I forgot it.
Our library, I think we've got one of the nicest libraries, at least in the state of Virginia. I think it was the nicest library for any county before they added on. To be able to show that off is great. I had family come in and I said this is our library.
Barnesfield Park is a good one.
Number three. I could always say our Sheriff's Department. It's huge too. I've been on a tour. I think our Deputies are more prepared than they used to be. I remember the good old boy, one or two Deputies. Used to come by the house and "How are you?" and "I'm fine thank you." They seem very professional, much more so than I remember. So that would have to be a success.
What person, place, or thing do you think we lack in King George?
You look down at Dahlgren and they've got McDonald's and Burger King and Arby's. KFC and Taco Bell. Dunkin' Donuts. Starbucks. I love Jersey Mikes. And Five Guys. As much as I don't like the idea of development, I'd like to see one or two things up here near the Courthouse. We've got a Subway. So if we have to tell somebody where's the fast food, that's the only place we have on this side of the County. It's lacking. You've got to want to go to sit down to dinner. Which don't get me wrong, it took me awhile but I finally went into El Charro and they are good. It's really good food in there. Vinny's is not too bad either. But the only place I can run into is Subway.
Jean and I have started ordering pizza and stuff from Pizza Bono. We told them the other day that we're one of their hot spots. They'll bring up here all the time. All I have to say is the museum. Yeah, I would like to see a couple, not a whole lot, just a couple choices up here. I'd go to Dahlgren for Chik-fil-A.
I have to say two. Bill Deyo. He's the historian for the Potomac [Patawomeck] Tribe. He could tell you anything you wanted to know about Stafford County people. Even who didn't have the right father or right child, he knew them all. He says his Aunt Polly told him everything. He did a lot of genealogy for Stafford. Of course some of that blew over into King George so he was quite an inspiration.
The other one was our friend Aubrey Jennings. When he retired from Dahlgren, several years before I did, he went to work and most of what is in our file cabinets came from him.
What is your ideal vision for King George County in the future?
Very controlled development. I really wouldn't want to see any more but that's not going to happen. But I would like to see a lot of consideration for our history. A lot of times people will just go bulldozing through something and have no idea about the history. No idea what should and shouldn't be preserved. But I'd like to see that supported by our government. I know they have a lot of other things that have to be done but that shouldn't cost any money, I wouldn't think.
I just have this fear that by the time I get old, I won't recognize the place. I often say that my mother, if she came back today, she would not know where she was.
What do you feel are the top 3 issues to address in King George?
I have to look right here. I try not to get involved with a lot of politics but you can't help it sometimes. The issue here is the County does not really address its history. We have a 300th anniversary coming up and they have formed a committee. Which is a lot better than what happened in 2007 when the whole state of Virginia celebrated the 400th anniversary of Jamestown. We took the lead on that, as in the Historical Society, and we started with the Administrator and it went down to the Assistant and then he sent us to Parks and Rec. So the County never really got into it at all. So that's basically why we wrote the book to that we at least had something to show for it even if the County didn't participate.
Now there's the issue about the Courthouse. I don't want to see anything happen to this building but that may not happen. They, as in our government officials, have convinced me to move our research area into the Virginiana Room in the Smoot Library. I finally agreed after many, many questions. Our books are still our books. Our files are still our files. We'll keep this area, the museum, just for our museum pieces.
The last is we have museum pieces in this County in private homes. We've never been able to show them. They're beautiful pieces. It's lack of space. We found these cases here that go up higher to get more stuff in these than the shorter ones and that's fine for the smaller pieces but it's not good for the bigger stuff. We have a loom. We have a beautiful quilt that was done by slaves in 1835. The family gave it to us because they didn't know what to do with it. It's probably larger than a King Size bed. Some of the spots, some of the areas on it, the material is still bright enough to see the design. You can see the stitching. Very few places where it was torn. But we have to keep it on the shelf in there covered in archival tissue paper. And there it sits. We have the old voting drum. It was a drum about this high that you turn and you'd stick your vote in the slot in the top like a big piggy bank and it rolled and went down. The votes had to be hand counted. We've got a beautiful settee that was sold at auction in 1842 from Spy Hill. What are we going to do with them? I was told we would keep this museum but the other day I was told no, everybody was getting out. We have no prospects. I think the problem is the people that worked on that have no clue what we've got.
What do you feel are the top 3 successes in King George?
I had one earlier and I forgot it.
Our library, I think we've got one of the nicest libraries, at least in the state of Virginia. I think it was the nicest library for any county before they added on. To be able to show that off is great. I had family come in and I said this is our library.
Barnesfield Park is a good one.
Number three. I could always say our Sheriff's Department. It's huge too. I've been on a tour. I think our Deputies are more prepared than they used to be. I remember the good old boy, one or two Deputies. Used to come by the house and "How are you?" and "I'm fine thank you." They seem very professional, much more so than I remember. So that would have to be a success.
What person, place, or thing do you think we lack in King George?
You look down at Dahlgren and they've got McDonald's and Burger King and Arby's. KFC and Taco Bell. Dunkin' Donuts. Starbucks. I love Jersey Mikes. And Five Guys. As much as I don't like the idea of development, I'd like to see one or two things up here near the Courthouse. We've got a Subway. So if we have to tell somebody where's the fast food, that's the only place we have on this side of the County. It's lacking. You've got to want to go to sit down to dinner. Which don't get me wrong, it took me awhile but I finally went into El Charro and they are good. It's really good food in there. Vinny's is not too bad either. But the only place I can run into is Subway.
Jean and I have started ordering pizza and stuff from Pizza Bono. We told them the other day that we're one of their hot spots. They'll bring up here all the time. All I have to say is the museum. Yeah, I would like to see a couple, not a whole lot, just a couple choices up here. I'd go to Dahlgren for Chik-fil-A.
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